Morality, Ethics, and Religion

[dean3333]

I work for a non-profit organization that cares for individuals with developmental disabilities. The organization is associated with a Christian religion that has done great work in the area of social services.

The leadership of the organization are obviously Christian and rely on their faith as a strength to lead the organization forward. They draw their inspiration from Christian morals and beliefs.

As a Deist, I have concluded that morality, respect, and ethics are necessary if society is to function in an organized and peaceful manner. One can see from dictatorial regimes around the world that harmony is missing in those cultures. Therefore, if we are unkind, unethical, and immoral, chaos and anarchy will reign in the absence of military power.

The world is ruled by self centered and "what's in it for me" mentality. I've concluded that in the absence of religion (as much as I do not like religions) many of the social programs created to assist others would not exist. Man as a collective body cannot be trusted to make the right decisions without the threat of displeasing God or moving against one's religious faith. Thoughts?

[MarkN]

Man as a collective body cannot be trusted to make the right decisions without the threat of displeasing God or moving against one's religious faith. Thoughts?

I disagree.

If one person is a good person because he believes he will be rewarded for his efforts (heaven) or punished if he fails (hell), and another person is a good person, not because he will recieve a reward or be punished if he fails but because it's just the right thing to do, which one is making the right decision for the right reason?

Religion is the use of the threat of eternal damnation for the purpose of control. For Power. Can religious people do good deeds? Certainly. Are there examples of religions that make positive contributions? Certainly.

Are they necessary (which I think is your point)? Perhaps for now they do some good, until man reaches the evolutionary level where he can dispense with the rituals, superstitions and dogmas of organized religions and do what is right because its the right thing to do.

Mark

[driver]

We're Deists and we believe it is a philosophy or a religion. We're good people and believe in standing up for what is right. While there are many religious programs out there to help people, there are many non-religious programs to also help people. How about atheists? They live very moral life's without any belief in a God. People can do the next right thing because it is the right thing to do and not from fear of being punished by a God and sent to a hell.

[gnomon]

Man as a collective body cannot be trusted to make the right decisions without the threat of displeasing God or moving against one's religious faith. Thoughts?

That statement probably summarizes the typical attitude and assumption of many religions, especially the Abrahamic faiths. And it's true that faith-based religion is probably the most effective means of controlling masses of people---in both the positive and negative senses. The more absolute and dictatorial the deity, the more efficient the religious system.

However, our modern sensibilities have been shaped by a taste of egalitarian democracy, which gives more power to the people. So even though dictators can make the trains run on time, they are less effective in winning the hearts and minds of the people. Democracy in government or religion is messy and inefficient, but it preserves the fragile rights and dignity of individuals, while maintaining some minimal control over the collective body.

At the moment, Deism is more of an anarchy than a democracy. But as it becomes more organized and focused, it won't have the divine clout to assert centralized authority. So some form of democratic control system will be required to channel the collective will of the members.

Herding cats is difficult, but theoretically possible.

[cclendenen]

...
Herding cats is difficult, but theoretically possible.

You just need to create a place they want to go.

[julie]

I worked for years in a company that managed group homes for the mentally ill. It is most definately a secular organization. Maybe I'm wrong, but it may be easier for religious organizations to receive funding for outreach orginazations, or they may have more know how than the average citizen. I think that's the main difference. Like I have what I think is an awesome idea to change the face of alchol/drug rehabilitation. Problem is, I have no resources to make a pilot program. A relogious orginization or some other group would have better luck getting it started. I think its resources not religion.

[gnomon]

Maybe I'm wrong, but it may be easier for religious organizations to receive funding for outreach orginazations, or they may have more know how than the average citizen. I think that's the main difference. Like I have what I think is an awesome idea to change the face of alchol/drug rehabilitation. Problem is, I have no resources to make a pilot program. A relogious orginization or some other group would have better luck getting it started. I think its resources not religion.

A few years ago, the Universist movement (semi-Deist) was incorporated as a non-profit religious and charitable organization, with the fund-raising and tax-break advantages in mind, in addition to the obvious intent of doing good works. The Unified Deism movement could do the same thing, and appoint you as the Director of Charities and Social Services. The legal hurdles are time-consuming, but once you are "official", access to resources should be enhanced.

[cclendenen]

Maybe I'm wrong, but it may be easier for religious organizations to receive funding for outreach orginazations, or they may have more know how than the average citizen. I think that's the main difference. Like I have what I think is an awesome idea to change the face of alchol/drug rehabilitation. Problem is, I have no resources to make a pilot program. A relogious orginization or some other group would have better luck getting it started. I think its resources not religion.

A few years ago, the Universist movement (semi-Deist) was incorporated as a non-profit religious and charitable organization, with the fund-raising and tax-break advantages in mind, in addition to the obvious intent of doing good works. The Unified Deism movement could do the same thing, and appoint you as the Director of Charities and Social Services. The legal hurdles are time-consuming, but once you are "official", access to resources should be enhanced.

We are looking at an initial charter as an unincorporated non-profit association first, although we intend to become incorporated once we grow and face potential liability issues. Either way, there is an opportunity and a desire for organizing for charitable works. Julie would be a wonderful candidate for leading such an effort.

[julie]

ME? Really, me??? That would be cool....What's involved?

[cclendenen]

ME? Really, me??? That would be cool....What's involved?

Time, money, people, ideas, lots of things we don't have enough of yet. How about we start with ideas? Where do we start with something small that's worthwhile?

[julie]

Depends what you wanna start with? Do you only want to deal with people, or animals too? There's a great charity where the representatives take the money and buy as many race horses that are being accutioned(sp) off for illegal and cruel slaughter. Or the national alliance for the mentally ill, food banks, or programs that help uninsured people afford their medicine, tutor programs for children of low incom families, big brother/sister mentoring programs, affordable programs that "tutor" autistic children for those that can't afford, reading circles for children, safe sex education for areas in misfortune, scholarships, sponsering parks or nature reserves, sponsering a highway stretch,working with prisoners who hope to be released in some capacity, a soup kitchen, just off the top of my head anyway...

[cclendenen]

See? You already have more going than I do. There's nothing on top of my head.

Anything, really. Is there anything global or national that takes small donations, or better yet, has opportunities for people to volunteer time, labor, homemade donations, etc? Ways for people to contribute, even if they don't have much themselves?